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Crosbie Fitch

Crosbie Fitch has been interested in non-copyright based revenue mechanisms ever since he realised the need for such things when envisioning the needs of very large scale virtual environments (massive multiplayer games, cyberspace, p2p based virtual worlds, distributed systems, etc.).

Will Money Still Make the World Go Round?

In other words if the 2nd and nth copies are free, you have to sell the first copy. Moreover, the first customer can't afford to buy it alone, you have to sell the first copy to a large proportion of customers.

Thus: The Digital Art Auction.

This was taken to prototype stage, but then suspended as it was too sophisticated.

QuidMusic (functional prototype) was created as a far simpler version. Fixed price: 1. Straightforward product: 'My next release'.

Realised that finding the right 'snowball' is best left to others, I've decided it'd be better to create a free engine and let all comers create their own sites that use it.

Hence currently working on The Contingency Market. An engine that facilitates collective bargains/funding.


Hi Crosbie, thanks for the introduction. Maybe you could be interested by our P2PMoney project. We are trying to start an open project for a payment pooling and shared revenue platform. Please, do not hesitate to contribute to the discussion there. -- FredericBaud

Hi Frederic, thanks for the welcome.

I am interested in your P2PMoney project. I am interested in payment pooling and revenue sharing.

I have tried to address both these considerations in the design of The Contingency Market.

-- CrosbieFitch

Yes, that was my understanding. Thank you for the confirmation. We are currently at the requirements collection process and existing situation analysis. Maybe you can replay part of our BarCamp:BarCampFlashMeeting6 (web-session visible here) to get a feeling of what we are thinking of. We should be organizing another flashmeeting when we have more materials from the P2PMoneyOrganizedInquiry. In the meantime, do not hesitate to contribute or raise additional questions on this wiki or on our BarCampBank Google group.

Maybe Sam has additional ideas on how we could start collaborating? -- FredericBaud

I will explore further over the next few days.

I will certainly not be shy to contribute where I feel it may be helpful.

I've just discovered that Sam has already come across my name: Creative Commons defends the author, and why this is necessary.

-- CrosbieFitch

Welcome Crosbie!

Man, I was wracking my brain trying to figure out where I had seem your name previously! thanks for reminding me. (I liked your comments here, too http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/?p=591)

ContingencyMarket (we should definitely make a page about it here) is definitely interesting. I like the logic behind it, the "agents, events, contingencies, offers, deals", I mean.

Your model could also work for (some) movies, it seems to me. And, maybe even books, art work, video content.

One of the projects we've got going at Open Business Models Wiki Hive is a open liscence and collaborative movie project called Extinction Level Event. I will definitely have to introduce them to your ideas here, and see if they could be useful when the time comes for the group to sell their product. Any advice would be greatly appreciated there.

Also, any input you can give us on our somewhat simpler, but still potentially very useful P2PMoney ideas here would be tremendously appreciated. I can see how some projects or entities could use both ContingencyMarket and P2Pmoney technology (like Extinction Level Event). This would allow people to basically pool money, share revenue, *and* create their own direct market/auction/etc. - SamRose

Hi Sam, thanks very much for the welcome.

I think we share an aspiration for simplicity, but we may well differ in terms of our threshold for 'no simpler' as in 'As simple as possible, but no simpler'.

I look forward to the evolution of your designs. Whilst you are of course welcome to review the design of the Contingency Market from the paltry documentation I've provided, it would be valuable to compare an independent design with precisely the same objectives. - CrosbieFitch

Hi Crosbie, would you have a link to the design information for Contingency Market? What kind of design documents would you think could be useful for a discussion (market requirement document, functional spec, high-level architecture document, technical spec,..)? -- FredericBaud

www.contingencymarket.com is about it as far as docs go. Click on Events or Contingencies, etc.

The web service has been live for yonks, but it hasn't actually been able to manipulate real money - that's what I'm working on at the mo. Once that's done I'll switch out the rough & ready equivalent PHP engine from QuidMusic and substitute calls to the ContingencyMarket web service.

From your perspective I'd decide precisely what your requirements are, figure out how the necessary system would work, and then spec it. And if you intend starting from scratch (even if hooked into a larger CMS like Drupal) keep things to the bare minimum - you are likely to throw the first attempt away anyway (hopefully after it's demonstrated utility).

I'm not sure if you have a leaning toward a highly pragmatic "Let's just get it working asap" approach, or a more idealistic and future-proof apprach, "Let's ensure the design is solid first, and then consider how we integrate it with the real world". -- CrosbieFitch

I've been building several IT systems (as a developper, architect or product manager) in the past and have a strong design bias to make future evolution more manageable. But this time, I would consider myself more on the business user side. BarCampBank is one of the communities that could definitely use a P2PMoney platform for its own tasks. Plus, P2PMoney falls neatly in what BarCampBank wants to promote (innovations and new business models in the world of banking and finance). So, as any business user, I'm more with the "let's get something working asap, we'll see what we can do with it". But I definitely can see both sides of the story. -- FredericBaud

Yes, we really didn't take a firm stance either way in the very beginning, because we wanted to see what currently existed first, and try to get feedback from knowledgeable people like yourself. -- SamRose

The aim of BarCampBank is to foster innovations and the creation of new business models in the world of banking and finance.

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